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"Black" Gun Recommendations
Discussions related to Guns and Firearms
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SwampFox
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PostPosted: Fri Feb 01, 2008 11:23 am    Post subject: Re: "Black" Gun Recommendations Reply with quote

Hey Joe,
The problem with the AR-10, which is the 308 version, is that the guns are real heavy. The 10T has a fluted 26 inch stainless bull barrel, it is even heavier than the 10. The advantage of the 10 and 10T is the standard base diameter bolt face with the real gun uppers (vs mouse guns). The 10T green stock Arnalite I just sold had a 308 upper and a 260 upper. The 260 in the AR is just somthing to behold. But you can get the 243, 7x08, 260, 358 Win, etc in an AR-10.

I would go with the 10T and a shorter barrel if I wanted the big bore gun.
Ed

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hunterjoe21
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PostPosted: Fri Feb 01, 2008 6:01 pm    Post subject: Re: "Black" Gun Recommendations Reply with quote

woods wrote:
Hey joe

I have a Bushmaster lower with a 24" bull barrel 1 in 8 DPMS upper



You mentioned 5.56 but I would recommend a 223. There is supposed to be a slight difference and you will find many more components in the 223.


Woods,

You know I respect your opinion, but this is copied from a link you supplied:



Clint Mckee, Fulton Armory wrote:
If we are talking about .223 Remington SAAMI-spec chambers in an AR15, OH NO!

Do NOT use such a chambering if you EVER plan on shooting any military NATO 5.56 ammo, which happens to be only the most common, least expensive and most widely used AR15 cartridge available in all the world. In other words, NEVER buy/use a SAAMI-spec chamber in a battle rifle, especially if the barrel and chamber are chromed, as you cannot fix it!

Here's the problem. Many NATO cartridges have bullets that will become jammed into the rifling of a SAAMI chambering (the throat is too short). This is VERY DANGEROUS, for a grat number of reasons."

I have no idea how old that quote is though. Not saying that I'm swimming in 5.56 ammo right now but if .223 will work safely in a 5.56 chamber, and NOT the other way around?

Big D mentioned the Wylde chamber. I noticed this on the Rock River site as well. But I also noticed that every weapon I've had my hands on lately is stamped:

"5.56/.223"

Does that mean they are all Wylde chambers?

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hunterjoe21
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PostPosted: Fri Feb 01, 2008 6:05 pm    Post subject: Re: "Black" Gun Recommendations Reply with quote

roklok wrote:
You arent limited to open sights with a fixed carry handle, I have a Colt A2 with the permanent carry handle, fixed stock and 20" barrel. I then mounted a 2-7 Leupold on the carry handle using a promag base. I like this arrangement...........I have a choice between the military A2 sights or the scope. The scope sets a bit high but is ideal for Alaskan winters when bundled up with face masks, hood, and goggles where a low mounted scope would not work without removing clothing. This rifle has been bouncing on my back for hundreds of miles on the snowmachine including some wrecks and rollovers without losing zero. It is a solid arrangement. I killed a large bull caribou two weekends ago with this rifle shooting the military SS109 62 grain green tip ammuntion. In my opinion, a flat top AR only makes sense if you go with a removable front sight also, as the front sight sticking up precludes low scope mounting.

Roklok,

Are you able to post a picture of yours?

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Dimitri
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PostPosted: Fri Feb 01, 2008 6:07 pm    Post subject: Re: "Black" Gun Recommendations Reply with quote

Roklok,

Yup don't need a flat top to install a scope on a AR. There are mounts for it such as ARMS.

[img]http://www.armsmounts.com/viewimg.php?item_id=1&image=picture[/img]

Would like to see your rifle though too! Very Happy

hunterjoe21 wrote:
Big D mentioned the Wylde chamber. I noticed this on the Rock River site as well. But I also noticed that every weapon I've had my hands on lately is stamped:

"5.56/.223"

Does that mean they are all Wylde chambers?

Don't know myself if they are all the same but its the same basic theory on "Match" 5.56mm NATO, a 223Rem chamber will fit a 5.56mm NATO round, so with a bigger lead you still get the benefits of a reduction in pressure and keep things tighter which is better for accuracy.

Still they can I guess simply chamber it for 5.56mm NATO and stamp that marking on it cause its safe to shoot both of them in that one same chamber. As a 5.56mm NATO chamber will accept and shoot 223Rem ammunition without a problem.

Which in my opinion means unless the manufacturer specifies that its a Wylde chamber or says how they chamber their 5.56mm NATO/223Rem chambers that its a longer leade with a tighter 223Rem chamber I'd ask the company how they chamber them. Smile

Dimitri

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hunterjoe21
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PostPosted: Fri Feb 01, 2008 6:24 pm    Post subject: Re: "Black" Gun Recommendations Reply with quote

chambered221 wrote:
Joe

Buy the RockRiver!!!!!!!!!!!!!

The reason you don't see them in gun shops, they are built and shipped at customer request. No middle man. You just need a FFL to send to for the transfer.

221,

Turns out, I know a guy with 4 of 'em hangin' on the wall. He keeps his "black" gun business kinda quiet, but when I asked he was more than willing to share his inventory. He's a full-time Sheriff's Deputy that also owns and operates 2 outdoor supply shops, a rifle and pistol range, and a separate archery range. He also sells Bushmaster and DPMS, but HIGHLY recommended the RR. All the members of his department have switched to them, and claims that the DEA are in process of switching from BFI.

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Last edited by hunterjoe21 on Fri Feb 01, 2008 7:39 pm; edited 1 time in total
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chambered221
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PostPosted: Fri Feb 01, 2008 6:52 pm    Post subject: Re: "Black" Gun Recommendations Reply with quote

I thought the DEA had already switched over to the RR!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Sounds to me like you got the FFL thing taken care of!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Now make the phone call!!!!!!!!!!!!
Rock River Arms Inc. TOLL FREE ORDER LINE 866-980-ROCK (7625)

Do yourself a favor and get the A4 with a detachable carry handle, that way if later???????????????????? Get my point???????????????

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Dimitri
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PostPosted: Fri Feb 01, 2008 6:55 pm    Post subject: Re: "Black" Gun Recommendations Reply with quote

The DEA has switched starting in December 2003 when the contract was awarded for at least 5,000 rifles over a period of 5 years.

This link talks about their requirements and why they selected RRA and then the writers review of the Goverment Model that RRA sells which is identical to the DEA version except with a 16" Barrel instead of a 14.5" Barrel.

findarticles.com/p/art...i_n6180945



Dimitri

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chambered221
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PostPosted: Fri Feb 01, 2008 7:03 pm    Post subject: Re: "Black" Gun Recommendations Reply with quote

When you see the price of it !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Add up evrything it comes with , then decide if its too much!!!!!

Its a good deal if you want all them bells and whistles. Very Happy

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roklok
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PostPosted: Fri Feb 01, 2008 7:11 pm    Post subject: Re: "Black" Gun Recommendations Reply with quote

Here is the best picture I have of my AR-15. I am currently without a digital camera as mine froze on a recent trip and stopped working. When I get another camera I will post a closeup. Hopefully you can tell from this picture how the scope sits on the rifle. I used low rings, and the scope is not that much higher than the sights.



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Dimitri
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PostPosted: Fri Feb 01, 2008 7:15 pm    Post subject: Re: "Black" Gun Recommendations Reply with quote

Chambered,

Yup its expensive with those attachments as a "kit" but I guess some people would like a "selected" pre-built version instead of picking out the bells and whistles them self. Smile

I think the AR-15 looks best without all of that myself, don't ask me why but I always found the AR-15 to look the best without anything at all attached to it. Cool

Roklok,

I like the view! Open country with patches of bush. Very Happy

Dimitri

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hunterjoe21
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PostPosted: Fri Feb 01, 2008 7:29 pm    Post subject: Re: "Black" Gun Recommendations Reply with quote

AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH

Someone disconnect Chambered 221's apostrophe key.................

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chambered221
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PostPosted: Fri Feb 01, 2008 7:33 pm    Post subject: Re: "Black" Gun Recommendations Reply with quote

Popcorn

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hunterjoe21
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PostPosted: Fri Feb 01, 2008 7:36 pm    Post subject: Re: "Black" Gun Recommendations Reply with quote

chambered221 wrote:
:popcorn:

Of course you KNOW i'm bustin yer chops.............

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hunterjoe21
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PostPosted: Fri Feb 01, 2008 7:42 pm    Post subject: Re: "Black" Gun Recommendations Reply with quote

chambered221 wrote:
I thought the DEA had already switched over to the RR

See, I told ya I hadn't kept up with this stuff....

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chambered221
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PostPosted: Fri Feb 01, 2008 7:45 pm    Post subject: Re: "Black" Gun Recommendations Reply with quote

Very Happy

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