View previous topic :: View next topic |
Author |
Message |
stablebuck Rookie Member
Joined: Jan 04, 2007 Posts: 15 Location: Layton, UT
|
Posted: Fri Jan 05, 2007 9:33 am Post subject: bullet type/speed, proximity of game, and impact of shot |
|
I usually meat hunt in South Texas every winter and the last couple years even when making clean lung shots with a 25-06 and 300 WSM 80 lbs does will run at least 50 yds before collapsing.
Most of these shots are under 100 yds and I was using ballistic tipped nosler bullets.
Years before when hunting with core-lokt bullets in a 243 Win the does would drop instantly from a lung shot.
I think that the bullet manufacturers have been counterproductive in an effort to conserve bullet weight retention and programmed bullet deformation. In doing so, they have essentially reinvented the FMJ bullet. Of course if you are trying to plant a bull elk with a heart/lung shot thru the shoulder blades then some of these bullets would be perfect, but for meat hunting situations it seems that the cheapest PSP bullets are the best medicine.
Thoughts?
|
|
Back to top |
|
|
glockman55 Super Member
Joined: Dec 12, 2005 Posts: 831 Location: Michigan
|
Posted: Fri Jan 05, 2007 9:42 am Post subject: Re: bullet type/speed, proximity of game, and impact of shot |
|
Myself I'll shoot the Deer between the shoulder and neck, if I feel comfortable at the range. They drop in their tracks. That's just me. Usually the heart lung area is the best % shot though.
|
|
Back to top |
|
|
Bushmaster Super Member
Joined: Jun 12, 2005 Posts: 11390 Location: Ava, Missouri
|
Posted: Fri Jan 05, 2007 9:48 am Post subject: Re: bullet type/speed, proximity of game, and impact of shot |
|
When ballistic tip bullets first hit the market they had a problem with them not opening up when they hit the game animal. They (The bullet manufacturers) said they solved that problem. My thoughts? NO...I still use soft point and flat point bullets. They (the game animal) drop right now if I do my part.
Remington Core-Lokt bullets are still hard to beat. Proof? Remington still sells them in loaded ammunition and bulk bullets for reloaders. Like Stablebuck, before I started reloading I took a lot of deer and elk with Remington Core-Lokt ammunition. And if I had to stop reloading I would go back to the Core-Lokt Remington ammunition.
_________________ I have one nerve left and yer standin' on it...
DEMOCRACY Two wolves and one sheep voting on what to have for lunch...
LIBERTY A well armed sheep contesting the outcome of the vote... |
|
Back to top |
|
|
Shipster Member
Joined: Dec 15, 2006 Posts: 26 Location: Oregon
|
Posted: Fri Jan 05, 2007 10:44 am Post subject: Re: bullet type/speed, proximity of game, and impact of shot |
|
stablebuck I have found the opposite with the Nosler BT bullets. In the past out of my .280 Rem with 140 gr. they have a grenade affect and do more damage then needed, at 3080 fps it is ugly. My friends 308 with Nosler BT 150 gr bullet at 2850 does the exact same thing. 25-06 100 gr Nosler BT the same thing. So we quit using Nosler BT bullets, the best preforming bullet that I have found for me has been the Speer Flatbase Hotcore. I have taken probably 30 deer with the 145 gr bullet from ranges of 50 to 650 yards and have only recovered 1 bullet. Penetration is excellent and expansion is excellent and the price is still awesome. My son just got a Weatherby Vanguard in 300 WSM and wanted to try the Nosler 180 accubonds and we will see what happens.
_________________ Shipster
Relaxation Technique: deep breath in; exhale; deep breath in; exhale slowly, hold.... and squeeze..... |
|
Back to top |
|
|
1895ss Super Member
Joined: Jul 21, 2005 Posts: 2612 Location: Not Here...!!
|
Posted: Fri Jan 05, 2007 11:15 am Post subject: Re: bullet type/speed, proximity of game, and impact of shot |
|
I never use Nosler bullets for deer hunting. In my 25-06 I use 117 gr BTSP Hornady's, and when deer are hit in the chest area, they fall in their tracks as a rule with a few going a few yards. Bushy's right about the Rem core-lokt bullets.
_________________ A cruel truth is much more desirable than a really nice lie.
'Tis far better to walk alone than to follow a crowd or an a**hole going the wrong way. |
|
Back to top |
|
|
moose2 Super Member
Joined: Mar 19, 2005 Posts: 707 Location: North Idaho
|
Posted: Fri Jan 05, 2007 8:36 pm Post subject: Re: bullet type/speed, proximity of game, and impact of shot |
|
I have used the Nossler BT's in my .257 Roberts and 6mm, though they took animals, I got alot of pass throughs which I didn't believe a good bullet should do. Since gone back to using 117 Sierra Prohunters in the .257 and am quite satisfied with them. I tried using the Hornadys, but the Sierras were noticeable more accurate in my .257.
_________________ tr |
|
Back to top |
|
|
stablebuck Rookie Member
Joined: Jan 04, 2007 Posts: 15 Location: Layton, UT
|
Posted: Sat Jan 06, 2007 10:41 pm Post subject: Re: bullet type/speed, proximity of game, and impact of shot |
|
257 Roberts?!?! You are old school!!! That's my dad's favorite he got it in the model 70 in 1958. He shot his first trophy whitetail buck with it then and I shot my first with it 39 years later. What a great cartridge!
|
|
Back to top |
|
|
moose2 Super Member
Joined: Mar 19, 2005 Posts: 707 Location: North Idaho
|
|
Back to top |
|
|
stablebuck Rookie Member
Joined: Jan 04, 2007 Posts: 15 Location: Layton, UT
|
|
Back to top |
|
|
moose2 Super Member
Joined: Mar 19, 2005 Posts: 707 Location: North Idaho
|
Posted: Mon Jan 08, 2007 1:57 pm Post subject: Re: bullet type/speed, proximity of game, and impact of shot |
|
10-4--Keep on Strokin
_________________ tr |
|
Back to top |
|
|
guncollector Member
Joined: Apr 25, 2006 Posts: 68 Location: Houston, Texas
|
Posted: Wed Jan 10, 2007 2:39 pm Post subject: Re: bullet type/speed, proximity of game, and impact of shot |
|
A double lung shot that does not also take out the heart or major arteries will obviously kill a deer but not until the blood still circulating runs out of oxygen for the muscles. Usually takes about 100 yards. If you take out the heart, in my experience, the deer seldom go more than 20 yards. The only way to drop a deer on the spot is to stop the brain, sever the spinal cord or get lucky enough that they go into shock along with a fatal wound.
As far as bullet construction, thin skinned animals like deer can be killed with just about anything from a lead mini-ball to the latest greatest fail safe ballistic X super bullet. Personnaly, I use either Sierra Game Kings or Barnes X bullets.
_________________ If the Government doesn't trust us with our guns, why should we trust them with theirs? |
|
Back to top |
|
|
yotebuster Member
Joined: Oct 16, 2005 Posts: 216 Location: Georgia
|
Posted: Wed Jan 10, 2007 7:42 pm Post subject: Re: bullet type/speed, proximity of game, and impact of shot |
|
I too shoot a 257 "Bob" and can't say enough about its ability to kill and its mild manners. A real joy to shoot. Mine doesn't like anything heavier than 90 grain bullets though.
An instant "dirt nap" can be accomplished with a high shoulder shot, IMHO. I've got a few hunting spots that I definitely don't want game to run away and I employ that shot whenever possible. But, I don't use it if the game is quartering away to much. Broadside, or nearly broadside shots are preferred.
I've had good luck with Nosler BT's and also can't say enough about Core Loks. They are hard to beat.
Yotebuster [b]
_________________ May all your Bloodtrails be Vertical! |
|
Back to top |
|
|
sniper Super Member
Joined: Aug 18, 2005 Posts: 735 Location: Utah
|
Posted: Sat Jan 13, 2007 9:51 pm Post subject: Re: bullet type/speed, proximity of game, and impact of shot |
|
stablebuck wrote: |
257 Roberts?!?! You are old school!!! What a great cartridge! |
Exactly! "New and Improved"= marketing run amok!
I checked out the numbers for the short, fat 25 WSSM. Not a great deal better than the OOoold Roberts. I like mine.
For that matter, performance wise, most of the the "newer" cartridges are the old standards with a new coat of paint.
|
|
Back to top |
|
|
4rum Member
Joined: Jan 06, 2007 Posts: 211
|
Posted: Sun Jan 14, 2007 6:39 am Post subject: Re: bullet type/speed, proximity of game, and impact of shot |
|
I think you guys have hit on a real issue here. The newer "hotter" calibers are selling due to hype in the trades (some deserved, some not). Following closely and trying to keep up with the market, the bullet and component manufacturers are now supplying bullets for the buyers market. They do not always perform well on the lower end of the velocity spectrum.
I'm pretty old fashioned, I hunt whitetail now with either an old 7 mauser or even an old 8 mm mauser. It is difficult to find a quality bullet that I'm satisfied with first, then performs well on paper and meat. Luckily I have found loads that work great for both guns. I use these old 'war horses' by choice. I've owned and shot deer (white tails) with just about everything. Even shot a nice buck with a sling shot once (my mother will attest to the shot, she was with me) ((no I didn't hurt the deer)) (((well it probably stung pretty darn good, I shot him with a marble))) ((((ya'll like parenthesis?)))) (((((ok for those that do here's a couple extry () )))))
Point being, I agree with what I think is being said, SOME current bullet construction is tailored to higher velocities than some cartridges loaded with that bullet diameter will perform effectively with. We probably should pay greater attention to ACTUAL velocity we can generate and choose bullets which will perform in that range.
|
|
Back to top |
|
|
|