HuntingNut
HuntingNut
   Login or Register
HomeCommunity ForumsPhoto AlbumsRegister
     
 

User Info

Welcome Anonymous


Membership:
Latest: RichardZ
New Today: 0
New Yesterday: 0
Overall: 13126

People Online:
Members: 0
Visitors: 235
BOT: 0
Total: 235
Who Is Where:
 Visitors:
01: Forums
02: Forums
03: Forums
04: Your Account
05: Forums
06: Forums
07: Forums
08: Home
09: Forums
10: Forums
11: Home
12: Forums
13: Home
14: Your Account
15: Photo Albums
16: Forums
17: Your Account
18: Forums
19: Forums
20: Forums
21: Home
22: Home
23: Home
24: Forums
25: Your Account
26: Photo Albums
27: Forums
28: Forums
29: Forums
30: Home
31: Forums
32: Forums
33: Forums
34: Forums
35: Forums
36: Forums
37: Home
38: Forums
39: Forums
40: Home
41: Forums
42: Forums
43: Forums
44: Your Account
45: Forums
46: Forums
47: Home
48: Your Account
49: Photo Albums
50: PointBlank Ballistics
51: Forums
52: Forums
53: Photo Albums
54: Forums
55: Forums
56: Home
57: Home
58: Home
59: Forums
60: Forums
61: Forums
62: Forums
63: Home
64: Forums
65: Reloading Database
66: Forums
67: Home
68: Home
69: Forums
70: Forums
71: Home
72: Forums
73: Photo Albums
74: Forums
75: Forums
76: Forums
77: Forums
78: Forums
79: Home
80: Forums
81: Forums
82: Home
83: Forums
84: Forums
85: Forums
86: Forums
87: Your Account
88: Home
89: Home
90: Your Account
91: Forums
92: Forums
93: Home
94: Forums
95: Home
96: Forums
97: Forums
98: Home
99: Forums
100: Forums
101: Forums
102: Home
103: Your Account
104: Home
105: Home
106: Forums
107: Forums
108: Forums
109: Photo Albums
110: Forums
111: Forums
112: Forums
113: Forums
114: Home
115: Your Account
116: Home
117: Photo Albums
118: Forums
119: Forums
120: Forums
121: Forums
122: Forums
123: Forums
124: Home
125: Forums
126: Forums
127: Your Account
128: Forums
129: Forums
130: Forums
131: Home
132: Forums
133: Forums
134: Forums
135: Forums
136: Reloading Database
137: Forums
138: Forums
139: Your Account
140: Forums
141: Photo Albums
142: Forums
143: Forums
144: Forums
145: Your Account
146: Home
147: Forums
148: Your Account
149: Photo Albums
150: Your Account
151: Home
152: Forums
153: Forums
154: Forums
155: Forums
156: Forums
157: Forums
158: Forums
159: Forums
160: Forums
161: Forums
162: Home
163: Forums
164: Forums
165: Forums
166: Forums
167: Your Account
168: Home
169: Forums
170: Forums
171: Home
172: Forums
173: Forums
174: Forums
175: Forums
176: Forums
177: Your Account
178: Forums
179: Home
180: Forums
181: Forums
182: Forums
183: Forums
184: Forums
185: Forums
186: Forums
187: Forums
188: Forums
189: Your Account
190: Your Account
191: Photo Albums
192: Photo Albums
193: Forums
194: Forums
195: Forums
196: Home
197: Forums
198: Forums
199: Forums
200: Forums
201: Forums
202: Forums
203: Forums
204: Forums
205: Forums
206: News
207: Photo Albums
208: Forums
209: Forums
210: Forums
211: Home
212: Forums
213: Forums
214: Home
215: Forums
216: Forums
217: Home
218: Forums
219: Forums
220: Forums
221: Forums
222: Forums
223: Forums
224: Home
225: Forums
226: Forums
227: Forums
228: Forums
229: Forums
230: Forums
231: Forums
232: Your Account
233: Photo Albums
234: Your Account
235: Your Account

Staff Online:

No staff members are online!
 

Coppermine Stats
Photo Albums
 Albums: 308
 Pictures: 2451
  · Views: 820725
  · Votes: 1316
  · Comments: 86
 

Thoughts on 7.62X25 with...
Discussion regarding the reloading of ammunition and tuning of loads for accuracy
Post new topic   Reply to topic   Printer Friendly Page    Forum Index » Reloading Ammunition

View previous topic :: View next topic  
Author Message
4rum
Member
Member


Joined: Jan 06, 2007
Posts: 211

PostPosted: Mon Jan 08, 2007 9:25 am    Post subject: Thoughts on 7.62X25 with... Reply with quote

... Sierra's 125 grain hollow point, .308 diameter # 2020 bullet in a CZ-52. This is a heavy bullet for the little cartridge. I have loaded some, I have not shot them yet.

The bullet has a large, soft, exposed hollow point. It was designed for the .30-30 to use on deer sized game. I've had to seat the bullets pretty deep so that they will clear inside the magazine. I seem to still have a good seal around the case mouth and the bullets are held firmly in place.

I've backed down on the powder charge to where I'm guessing I have just enough ooomph to work the slide. (Guessing after years of succesful reloading and careful practices). I have found no data for a bullet this heavy in the caliber.

Primary initial use for this loading is nothing more than comparison shots on wet catalogues. IF the bullet shows indications of expansion and or accuracy, I'll try loading more with heavier charges.

I won't list any charge weights here for fear of them being mistaken for an endorsement. I'm interested in input or thoughts about the bullet's possibilities in this specific caliber and gun.
Back to top
View user's profile
Dimitri
Super Member
Super Member


Joined: Nov 25, 2005
Posts: 5944

PostPosted: Mon Jan 08, 2007 2:38 pm    Post subject: Re: Thoughts on 7.62X25 with... Reply with quote

Interesting idea, that load is pretty heavy compared to the issue load of 85-grs I belive, I wonder if you'd end up getting a subsonic or near subsonic round. Don't know much about the round so I dont know what to tell you execpt use a section of a cleaning rod to make sure there is nothing to get stuck in the barrel of the handgun Smile

Goodluck and post your progress. Very Happy

Dimitri

_________________
A thousand hills, but no birds in flight, ten thousand paths, with no people's tracks. A lonely boat, a straw-hatted old man, fishing alone in the cold river snow.
Back to top
View user's profile Photo Gallery
Bushmaster
Super Member
Super Member


Joined: Jun 12, 2005
Posts: 11390
Location: Ava, Missouri

PostPosted: Mon Jan 08, 2007 3:27 pm    Post subject: Re: Thoughts on 7.62X25 with... Reply with quote

Be very careful. And watch for a stuck bullet about 1/2 way down the barrel...Just be careful...

_________________
I have one nerve left and yer standin' on it...

DEMOCRACY Two wolves and one sheep voting on what to have for lunch...
LIBERTY A well armed sheep contesting the outcome of the vote...
Back to top
View user's profile
gelandangan
Super Member
Super Member


Joined: May 07, 2006
Posts: 6396
Location: Sydney Australia

PostPosted: Mon Jan 08, 2007 4:03 pm    Post subject: Re: Thoughts on 7.62X25 with... Reply with quote

Gidday 4rum

Your 7.62x25 sounds like my 300 whisper (.308 dia bullet in expanded 221-fireball case). I use up to 240gn woodleigh bullet on it and it prints about 1 inch at 100 meters with 7.5gn of W231. I have used 130gn sierra hollow points on 16.5gn of AR2205 to get to 1800fps and it shoots about 1.5 inches group at 100 meters. My rifle have a 1 in 8 twist 24 inches MAB barrel on a CZ mini mauser action.

The 300 whisper works like a charm on goats but I have yet to shoot at larger animals.

I hope this helps.

Gelan

_________________
A straight line is the shortest distance between two points.
A smile is the shortest distance between two people.

Do - Not try!


gelandangan.weebly.com/
Back to top
View user's profile Visit poster's website
4rum
Member
Member


Joined: Jan 06, 2007
Posts: 211

PostPosted: Mon Jan 08, 2007 4:31 pm    Post subject: Re: Thoughts on 7.62X25 with... Reply with quote

Thanks everyone for the input and especially the cautions. Shows you are a conscientous group, I appreciate that.

gelandangan;

This is a project I'm looking into for one of my CZ52 semi-auto handguns. I have good loading data for 85 and 90 grain bullets. The 125 is a heavier bullet, but I'm looking into the expansion capabilities at short yardage. The bullets design may let it open appreciably even at the velocities I will be able to generate from the 4" inch barrel handgun.

Thank everyone once again for their concerns of safety. I am very safety conscious myself and will use precautions. The starting load is mild, but I feel it will not leave the bullet in the barrel. I wanted to start low just for safties sake, I'll worry about feed, function, stabalization due to twist and such later. First I want to make the gun/round run... safely.
Back to top
View user's profile
gelandangan
Super Member
Super Member


Joined: May 07, 2006
Posts: 6396
Location: Sydney Australia

PostPosted: Mon Jan 08, 2007 9:03 pm    Post subject: Re: Thoughts on 7.62X25 with... Reply with quote

4rum, if you are loading for subsonic, make sure that you are starting HIGH and work your way down. AND check your barrel after every shot so that if the bullet did stuck you won't get in trouble.

I don't know of any .30 cal bullet that would expand reliably at subsonic speed. Therefore to ensure energy transfer, I opt for longer heavier bullet in the hope that they would cut sideways when tumbling and enlarge the hole. I find that the more unstable the bullet (heavier at the back) the better it would tend to tumble. I tried this with wetted phone directories. I hope it would give me some parallelism in the gameflesh.

Gelan

_________________
A straight line is the shortest distance between two points.
A smile is the shortest distance between two people.

Do - Not try!


gelandangan.weebly.com/
Back to top
View user's profile Visit poster's website
4rum
Member
Member


Joined: Jan 06, 2007
Posts: 211

PostPosted: Mon Jan 08, 2007 9:52 pm    Post subject: Re: Thoughts on 7.62X25 with... Reply with quote

Let me clarify a little.

I know that ballistics and or loading data cannot be reliably interpolated. It is a science of test, examine, test, test, test... preferably under controled conditions. My interest here lies with a particular bullet.

The CZ52 was introduced to operate with the 85 to 87 grain roundnose full metal jacket. It feeds and functions very well with this bullet. Sierra makes a wonderful little 85 grain round nose soft point which feeds and functions just as well and gives me mediocer expansion. (Shot into various media for comparison only. No tissue examples).

The Sierra 125 grain hollow point was designed especially for Whitetail deer out to 150 to 200 yards. It is produced with a large hollow cavity and lots of exposed soft lead. Inside, however, is a harder lead core to aid in penetration.

I'm hoping that if the bullet will expand at 200 yards with the remaining velocity of a .30-30, that it will expand at 5 to 10 yards from the stock CZ52 handgun.

The reason for loading light was for safety, as I have not seen any data for bullets heavier than 110 grains. I am loading below that in charge weight for safety only, not to attain or achieve any sonic levels.

There are several things to consider. Would this bullet, if reliable make a better (not great or perfect... better) home defense loading for the CZ52? The round has to be shot to begin to answer. I want to do that as safely as I can.

The 125 grain bullet is long for this round to fit into the magazine. I have seated it deep enough to load well into the magazine. It seems to still grip the bullet firmly, just on the cusp of the ogive. Thus the first hurdle is hopefully resolved. Next it has to operate the pistol. With the light powder charge it may not, but I'm not going to worry about that till I check for pressure signs and make decisions whether or not to up the powder charge. The charge I have chosen is in the bottom of listed loads for the 110 grain bullet. I feel safe loading the 125 grain to these pressure levels. All three of my CZ52's are of the 'unissued' quality. They show no wear or damage in any respect. They are in good repair and appear in near perfect condition.

I'm not in a hurry. This is a 'think and do' project. I won't accept poor results in ANY facet of this. To be useful, a round has to be reliable. I don't have a chronograph. I don't know what velocity I'll achieve. It really doesn't matter if the bullets perform well and are at least of acceptable short range accuracy. (Say from my secure position behind the bed to mid room).

In short ...ahem... this is not a hunting round. My interest lies solely in the possibility of a safe, more effective, reliable pistol/cartridge combo than any I can buy commercially, for the CZ52.

I've poked around on the boards. I have not seen a loading for this bullet in this caliber. There may be good reason. It may not work!
Back to top
View user's profile
gelandangan
Super Member
Super Member


Joined: May 07, 2006
Posts: 6396
Location: Sydney Australia

PostPosted: Tue Jan 09, 2007 12:21 am    Post subject: Re: Thoughts on 7.62X25 with... Reply with quote

OOPS!!! Embarassed

I forgot.. heheh... Daymn!!! I actually own a CZ52 (in .32 Auto) hehe.. IT IS A PISTOL!!!! GOsh.. been always talking rifles in this forum I forgot that CZ52 is a pistol.. wtf Now it is my turn to shove my foot into my mouth Yuck

Okay.. there is BIG difference from what I am thinking about. And it is nowhere similar to the 300 whisper Rolling Eyes

Since CZ52 is a pistol of about 4" barrel (mine is a 4.5incher to be legal in this land of OZ) yes, most load would be about transsonic velocity. I reckond as long as the velocity is high enough bullets made for PISTOL cartridges should expand reliably.

4rum, I do not think loading this pistol with higher than designed projectile is wise. You may generate very high pressure against the thin barrel wall. Until they make proper (100% factory model) replacement sparepart for your bodyparts you better stick with the smaller 80 - 100 gn projectile.

If you talk defense (which I know nothing about - since I am living in Oz and here we are not allowed to use our toys for defense) I think that it is better to use lighter pellets many times accurately (coz lighter pellet gives less recoil) than one great pellet which may or may not hit accurately and then fight the big recoil. Thus with many holes, the target should be more prone to fail functioning. Although a big wallop in the right place maybe would do the job better (viz. 45ACP in 1911 against the .38 in Phillipine), but could you guarantee the accuracy under pressure? Using a larger handgun may help, but the CZ52 is quite a small and light gun.

In Police Service Pistol Match here, we got to shoot a target 10 yards away with 12 rounds within 15 seconds (including reloading) shooting from below the shoulder unsighted. Because there is something called "Power Factor" we have to load the gun with "hot" load to make the power factor in "restricted" match. In "unrestricted" match, we do not worry about the power factor.
I find that using my S&W686 .357magnum, light bullet (a 75gn hollow cored butt nosed wadcutter at 800fps) I could easily place the whole 12 rounds in the X ring (about 2 inches diameter). I could not say the same with the full load (135gn BNWC at 1100fps) the recoil would send the muzzle waaay up to be able to do a quick follow up.

So ther is my 2 cents.

Gelan

_________________
A straight line is the shortest distance between two points.
A smile is the shortest distance between two people.

Do - Not try!


gelandangan.weebly.com/
Back to top
View user's profile Visit poster's website
4rum
Member
Member


Joined: Jan 06, 2007
Posts: 211

PostPosted: Tue Jan 09, 2007 3:39 pm    Post subject: Re: Thoughts on 7.62X25 with... Reply with quote

Thanks Gelan;

I agree with you. I have a load with the Sierra 85 gr. (It actually expands better than the 90 gr XTP in my trials). The 'tinkering' with the 125 is just one of those ideas that does have possibilities. There is good data for the 110 grain short jacket. Again my interest lies in a VERY large cavity with LOTs of soft exposed lead.

Your cautions are well noted. I agree with those points also. I do have other defense weapons. My choice is a 12 guage.
Back to top
View user's profile
atmmech96
Rookie Member
Rookie Member


Joined: Mar 12, 2005
Posts: 7
Location: Peoples Republic of Maryland

PostPosted: Sat Feb 10, 2007 12:11 pm    Post subject: Re: Thoughts on 7.62X25 with... Reply with quote

Let us know what happened with the 125's. I've got a 52 in 7.62x25 that I use when my flashlight gives out.The muzzle blast is somethingto see at duskwith Mil surp. I'm looking for a load that I can use that transfers most of the energy to the target. The 125's could be real interesting. Kyle
Back to top
View user's profile
4rum
Member
Member


Joined: Jan 06, 2007
Posts: 211

PostPosted: Sat Feb 10, 2007 4:38 pm    Post subject: Re: Thoughts on 7.62X25 with... Reply with quote

atmmech96;

I have some loaded. The bullets are seated pretty deep to clear in the magazine. I'm just waiting for weather right now. I just want to see if they will expand any better than other styles and weights of bullets I'm loading now. Then I will check accuracy and work up a load that I feel comfortable with.
Back to top
View user's profile
atmmech96
Rookie Member
Rookie Member


Joined: Mar 12, 2005
Posts: 7
Location: Peoples Republic of Maryland

PostPosted: Sat Feb 10, 2007 11:05 pm    Post subject: Re: Thoughts on 7.62X25 with... Reply with quote

Where did you find the 85's and 110's? I've got some brass now and I wouln't mind tring to get a load set up for the 52. I'm also looking for another barrel, mine is getting pretty shabby due to lots of use. Thanks, Kyle
Back to top
View user's profile
4rum
Member
Member


Joined: Jan 06, 2007
Posts: 211

PostPosted: Sun Feb 11, 2007 9:02 am    Post subject: Re: Thoughts on 7.62X25 with... Reply with quote

Midway has everything you need. I ordered Starline brass, Hornady .90 grain XTP's and Sierra 85 grain softpoint. (.308 diameter). I'm usning Winchester small pistol primers (standard) I'm currently loading my 'worked up' load with the Sierra softpoint, it expands much better in wet catalogues. When 'calving' time comes the neighbor usually loses a Charolais heffer or two, that's where I do my tissue comparisons.

I'm currently loading at very near Sierra's maximum listed load for the 85 grain bullet and Unique powder.

You may want to slug your barrel, mic the slug and determine your bore diameter. Some run larger. All three of mine mic at .307. If you have a pistol with a larger bore, you may want to try some of the 71 grain bullets, but they are a larger diameter (.311 or .312 I think). They are normally loaded in .32 auto and like calibers.

I'm VERY familiar with the muzzle blast of these little powerhouses. My CZ52's get a lot of respect at the range. We have a length of well casing at 200 yards... I don't hit it every time, but when I do, I'l always amazed at the flight time of the little 85's. It don't take them long to get there!
Back to top
View user's profile
Display posts from previous:   
Post new topic   Reply to topic   Printer Friendly Page    Forum Index » Reloading Ammunition
Page 1 of 1
All times are GMT - 7 Hours



Jump to:  


You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot vote in polls in this forum
You cannot attach files in this forum
You can download files in this forum


Valid CSS! Valid HTML 4.01!
Click to check if this page is realy HTML 4.01 compliant for speed :)

All logos and trademarks in this site are property of HuntingNut.com.
The comments are property of their posters, all the rest © 2011 by HuntingNut.com
Interactive software released under GNU GPL, Code Credits, Privacy Policy

.: Upgraded to DragonFly 9.2 by *Dizfunkshunal* :.