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Overworking the Brass?
Discussion regarding the reloading of ammunition and tuning of loads for accuracy
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slimjim
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PostPosted: Wed Jun 13, 2012 9:42 am    Post subject: Re: Overworking the Brass? Reply with quote

gelandangan wrote:
IMHO the least worked brass would be sized on a LEE Collet dies.

Agreed. Don't most that use a collet die turn their neck to get them all to the same thickness?

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gelandangan
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PostPosted: Wed Jun 13, 2012 8:47 pm    Post subject: Re: Overworking the Brass? Reply with quote

If you turn the neck for same thickness, it would only improve the consistency thus is beneficial.

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woods
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PostPosted: Wed Jun 13, 2012 10:23 pm    Post subject: Re: Overworking the Brass? Reply with quote

slimjim wrote:
gelandangan wrote:
IMHO the least worked brass would be sized on a LEE Collet dies.

Agreed. Don't most that use a collet die turn their neck to get them all to the same thickness?

Like gelandangan said it won't hurt and most likely will be beneficial.

But the bushing dies are where it becomes important to outside neck turn. The reason is that you choose a specific size bushing that sizes the outside of the neck to that diameter. So if you have a bushing size of .314" and a neck thickness variance from .013" to .015", then the outside diameter of the neck will size down to a perfect .314" but the .002" neck thickness variations will show up on the inside.

That is if you don't use the expander ball that comes with the bushing die. Most take out the expander stem and don't use it in the bushing dies because why pay all the extra money for a bushing die when you could just buy a regular full length die.

The Lee Collet has the interior mandrel that forms the inside diameter to a perfect dimension when the brass is pressed onto it. So IMO and is a general consensus that it is not necessary to outside neck turn for a collet die.

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slimjim
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PostPosted: Wed Jun 13, 2012 11:39 pm    Post subject: Re: Overworking the Brass? Reply with quote

Here are some good explanations about using the Lee Collet Dies

Part 1
www.youtube.com/watch?...ure=relmfu

Part 2
www.youtube.com/watch?...ure=relmfu

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PaulS
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PostPosted: Thu Jun 14, 2012 2:44 am    Post subject: Re: Overworking the Brass? Reply with quote

So, the free floating decapper pin didn't "self align" on one of the cases first time through and the ridges left by the collet cause stresses that will lead to neck splits?
That doesn't sound like a good choice to me, am I missing something?

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MacD
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PostPosted: Thu Jun 14, 2012 4:17 am    Post subject: Re: Overworking the Brass? Reply with quote

Not sure what you mean by free floating. The pin is rigid but able to slip upward if it encounters a blockage or, as I found out, Berdan primed case. As far as ridges I haven't had any problems. The collet does leave marks but these are not raised. If someone is getting ridges they don't have the die properly adjusted. There is an old adage that blaming ones tools is easier than admitting ones own mistakes. I am happy with all my Lee equipment. In fact the only tool that let me down was made by another manufacturer. A small modification fixed the issue.

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gelandangan
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PostPosted: Thu Jun 14, 2012 4:35 am    Post subject: Re: Overworking the Brass? Reply with quote

I don't seem to able to make ridges on the neck using the collet sizer.

Maybe some people got way too much muscles and push the press beyond what they are designed for.
It is common for loaders to want to get the strongest press so they do not flex when used to size large cases.
Thus the misconception of having to use large force to resize.

IMHO, using the right lubricant o a properly aligned press, the sizing should be do-able on a small press.
The leverage on a properly made press would exert just enough force to correct the dimension of the cases without deforming them.

Reloading is an art, it is not how strong you are, but it is how good you prepare your way.
you can use an axe to shape a statue, but a carving knife might do the job better.

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slimjim
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PostPosted: Thu Jun 14, 2012 10:04 am    Post subject: Re: Overworking the Brass? Reply with quote

woods wrote:
neck thickness variance from .013" to .015"

My new and once fired cases had neck variations of 0.001 and averaged 0.012". When I checked my cases that had been fired many, many times, they varied from 0.010 to 0.015. I retired them! Thank, woods, for suggesting I check this.

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slimjim
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PostPosted: Sat Jun 16, 2012 2:39 pm    Post subject: Re: Overworking the Brass? Reply with quote

I experienced a new sensation at the range today! After all that effort sizing, trimming, deburring, and cleaning my brass, one of them got away into the grass. Took a while to find the case. Felt like I lost my child!!

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PaulS
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PostPosted: Sat Jun 16, 2012 10:46 pm    Post subject: Re: Overworking the Brass? Reply with quote

That's exactly why I don't own any autos that I can reload for...



I HATE CHASING BRASS!!!!!!!!

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So and So's pages on the internet = NOT reliable loading data
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