HuntingNut
HuntingNut
   Login or Register
HomeCommunity ForumsPhoto AlbumsRegister
     
 

User Info

Welcome Anonymous


Membership:
Latest: StoneOrchid
New Today: 0
New Yesterday: 2
Overall: 12820

People Online:
Members: 0
Visitors: 285
BOT: 1
Total: 286
Who Is Where:
 Visitors:
01: Forums
02: Forums
03: Forums
04: Forums
05: Forums
06: Forums
07: Forums
08: Forums
09: Forums
10: Forums
11: Forums
12: Home
13: Forums
14: Forums
15: Forums
16: Home
17: Forums
18: Forums
19: Forums
20: Forums
21: Forums
22: Forums
23: Home
24: Forums
25: Forums
26: Photo Albums
27: Photo Albums
28: Forums
29: Forums
30: Forums
31: Forums
32: Forums
33: Forums
34: Forums
35: Forums
36: Forums
37: Forums
38: Forums
39: Forums
40: Forums
41: Forums
42: Forums
43: Forums
44: Forums
45: Forums
46: Forums
47: Photo Albums
48: Forums
49: Forums
50: Forums
51: Forums
52: Forums
53: Forums
54: Forums
55: Forums
56: Home
57: Forums
58: Home
59: Forums
60: Forums
61: Forums
62: Forums
63: Forums
64: Forums
65: Forums
66: Forums
67: Forums
68: Forums
69: Forums
70: Forums
71: Forums
72: Forums
73: Forums
74: Forums
75: Forums
76: Forums
77: Forums
78: Your Account
79: Forums
80: Forums
81: Forums
82: Forums
83: Forums
84: Forums
85: Forums
86: Forums
87: Forums
88: Forums
89: Forums
90: Forums
91: Forums
92: Forums
93: Forums
94: Forums
95: Forums
96: Forums
97: Forums
98: Forums
99: News
100: Forums
101: Home
102: Forums
103: Forums
104: Home
105: Forums
106: Forums
107: Forums
108: Forums
109: Forums
110: Forums
111: Your Account
112: Forums
113: Home
114: Forums
115: Forums
116: Forums
117: Forums
118: Forums
119: Forums
120: Forums
121: Forums
122: Home
123: Home
124: Forums
125: Forums
126: Forums
127: Forums
128: Forums
129: Photo Albums
130: Forums
131: Forums
132: Forums
133: Forums
134: Forums
135: Home
136: Your Account
137: Forums
138: Forums
139: Forums
140: Forums
141: Forums
142: Forums
143: Forums
144: Forums
145: Home
146: Forums
147: Your Account
148: Home
149: Forums
150: Home
151: Forums
152: Forums
153: Forums
154: Forums
155: Forums
156: Forums
157: Forums
158: Forums
159: Forums
160: Forums
161: Forums
162: Forums
163: Forums
164: Home
165: Forums
166: Forums
167: Forums
168: Forums
169: Forums
170: Forums
171: Forums
172: Forums
173: Forums
174: Your Account
175: Forums
176: Home
177: Forums
178: Forums
179: Forums
180: Your Account
181: Forums
182: Forums
183: Your Account
184: Home
185: Home
186: Home
187: Home
188: Forums
189: Forums
190: Forums
191: Home
192: Forums
193: Forums
194: Forums
195: Forums
196: Forums
197: Forums
198: Forums
199: Home
200: Forums
201: Forums
202: Forums
203: Forums
204: Forums
205: Forums
206: Forums
207: Forums
208: Forums
209: Forums
210: Home
211: Forums
212: Forums
213: Forums
214: Forums
215: Forums
216: Forums
217: Statistics
218: Forums
219: Forums
220: Forums
221: Forums
222: Forums
223: Forums
224: Forums
225: Home
226: Forums
227: Home
228: Forums
229: Forums
230: Forums
231: Forums
232: Forums
233: Forums
234: Forums
235: Forums
236: Forums
237: Forums
238: Forums
239: Forums
240: Forums
241: Home
242: Photo Albums
243: Forums
244: Home
245: Forums
246: Forums
247: Forums
248: Forums
249: Forums
250: Forums
251: Forums
252: Forums
253: Forums
254: Forums
255: Forums
256: Your Account
257: Forums
258: Forums
259: Your Account
260: Forums
261: Forums
262: Forums
263: Forums
264: Forums
265: Home
266: Forums
267: Forums
268: Forums
269: Forums
270: Forums
271: Forums
272: Forums
273: Forums
274: Forums
275: Forums
276: Forums
277: Forums
278: Forums
279: Forums
280: Forums
281: Forums
282: Forums
283: Forums
284: Forums
285: Forums
  BOT:
01: Your Account

Staff Online:

No staff members are online!
 

Coppermine Stats
Photo Albums
 Albums: 307
 Pictures: 2394
  · Views: 660362
  · Votes: 1312
  · Comments: 86
 

Loading 100 gr plinkers for 30-30
Discussion regarding the reloading of ammunition and tuning of loads for accuracy
Go to page Previous  1, 2, 3, 4  Next
Post new topic   Reply to topic   Printer Friendly Page    Forum Index » Reloading Ammunition

View previous topic :: View next topic  
Author Message
stovepipe
Super Member
Super Member


Joined: Sep 25, 2008
Posts: 4877
Location: Pine, Az.

PostPosted: Mon Aug 27, 2012 11:41 am    Post subject: Re: Loading 100 gr plinkers for 30-30 Reply with quote

Vince wrote:
I load 110gn HP Varminter in my 30.30 and they are great...very accurate, easy on the shoulder and are rather devastating on smaller light skinned game.

I load them over 35 gr of AR2206H (marketed as H4895 in the US). I agree with Paul...H4895 is a nice accurate powder for these light projectiles in the 30.30. Being a SP HP they are safe to use in the magazine of a Winchester Model 94.

Cheers, Vince

That's a nice looking home-rolled cartridge Vincent... Cool
Back to top
View user's profile
Vince
Super Member
Super Member


Joined: May 25, 2005
Posts: 14442
Location: Brisbane AUSTRALIA

PostPosted: Tue Aug 28, 2012 1:11 am    Post subject: Re: Loading 100 gr plinkers for 30-30 Reply with quote

HEY GELAN...ALOYS AND tlo7mm NEED YOUR ASSISTANCE WITH A SUBSONIC BLOOMPH ROUND MATE.

Seriously though guys...Gelan has put a massive amount of development/testing into some subsonic loads for his .300 Whisper and (I think) a 45.70...he is the subsonic guru.

Cheers, Vince

_________________
Cheers, Vince Cheers

Illegitimi non carborundum
(Never let the bastards grind you down)

Live simply. Love generously. Care deeply. Speak kindly. Leave the rest to God.

"Nulla Si Fa Senza Volonta."
(Without Commitment, Nothing Gets Done)
Back to top
View user's profile AIM Address MSN Messenger Yahoo Messenger Photo Gallery
Aloysius
Super Member
Super Member


Joined: Nov 03, 2009
Posts: 2252
Location: B., Belgium

PostPosted: Tue Aug 28, 2012 2:28 am    Post subject: Re: Loading 100 gr plinkers for 30-30 Reply with quote

Well it might be fun just to discuss about subsonic reloads or the requirements for such loads.
On one hand I would say a heavy bullet and a fast twist could be of great help, but then there is the smoothbore with even a heavier bullet and no twist at all...
That's the nice thing about reloading: you never know it all Smile
Back to top
View user's profile
tlo7mm
Super Member
Super Member


Joined: Nov 15, 2010
Posts: 420
Location: Oregon

PostPosted: Tue Aug 28, 2012 8:03 pm    Post subject: Re: Loading 100 gr plinkers for 30-30 Reply with quote

I picked up a box of 250 count cast 30-30 bullets today that I cannot wait to try out. I am looking at getting some more in the near future.

_________________
"If someone has a gun and is trying to kill you, it would be reasonable to shoot back with your own gun." ~ The Dalai Lama
Never ascribe to malice that which is adequately explained by incompetence. - Napoleon Bonaparte
The wisdom of man never yet contrived a system of taxation that would operate with perfect equality. - Andrew Jackson
Patriotism is supporting your country all the time, and your government when it deserves it. - Mark Twain
Back to top
View user's profile
Aloysius
Super Member
Super Member


Joined: Nov 03, 2009
Posts: 2252
Location: B., Belgium

PostPosted: Wed Aug 29, 2012 12:56 am    Post subject: Re: Loading 100 gr plinkers for 30-30 Reply with quote

I hope you chose a heavy weight? On the other hand, that little one used for the .30 M1 is also a good and very cheap plinker...
Back to top
View user's profile
tlo7mm
Super Member
Super Member


Joined: Nov 15, 2010
Posts: 420
Location: Oregon

PostPosted: Wed Aug 29, 2012 6:25 am    Post subject: Re: Loading 100 gr plinkers for 30-30 Reply with quote

right now I have a box of lightweight cast plinkers but I am going to get some heavy bullets for hunting to load. I am also thinking I am going to look into getting molds and all the stuff to make my own cast bullets for the 30-30.

_________________
"If someone has a gun and is trying to kill you, it would be reasonable to shoot back with your own gun." ~ The Dalai Lama
Never ascribe to malice that which is adequately explained by incompetence. - Napoleon Bonaparte
The wisdom of man never yet contrived a system of taxation that would operate with perfect equality. - Andrew Jackson
Patriotism is supporting your country all the time, and your government when it deserves it. - Mark Twain
Back to top
View user's profile
Vince
Super Member
Super Member


Joined: May 25, 2005
Posts: 14442
Location: Brisbane AUSTRALIA

PostPosted: Wed Aug 29, 2012 7:01 am    Post subject: Re: Loading 100 gr plinkers for 30-30 Reply with quote

If you can afford jacketed bullets tlo, that is the better option. That is not to say that cast boolits aren't accurate or suitable for hunting, they sure are, and I use them. However, unless you plan on shooting a heap of cast boolits, the expense of purchasing the moulds, lead pot, bullet alloy, gas checks, lube sizer and suitable dies will very quickly add up beyond what you would pay for jacketed bullets.

If you really want to cast, don't let me stop you...I cast, but then again I started when I was pistol shooting and shot between 200 and 300 rounds a week, which made it extremely cost effective. Also, before you venture into the world of casting, read up on the subject, gather as much info and knowledge as you can because there are quite a few little idiosyncrasies and tricks that you will need to know to make life easier and your boolits a better product.

Cheers, Vince

_________________
Cheers, Vince Cheers

Illegitimi non carborundum
(Never let the bastards grind you down)

Live simply. Love generously. Care deeply. Speak kindly. Leave the rest to God.

"Nulla Si Fa Senza Volonta."
(Without Commitment, Nothing Gets Done)
Back to top
View user's profile AIM Address MSN Messenger Yahoo Messenger Photo Gallery
tlo7mm
Super Member
Super Member


Joined: Nov 15, 2010
Posts: 420
Location: Oregon

PostPosted: Wed Aug 29, 2012 8:19 am    Post subject: Re: Loading 100 gr plinkers for 30-30 Reply with quote

thanks vince, I have been kind of checking into it. I am also considering casting for a .357 also but I just may buy bullets casted already. I am not sure, I just have been thinking about it.
I bought Badman Bullets and they are pretty reasonable in price. I may just stick with jacketed bullets also.
I don't know really, I am just toying around with the idea.

_________________
"If someone has a gun and is trying to kill you, it would be reasonable to shoot back with your own gun." ~ The Dalai Lama
Never ascribe to malice that which is adequately explained by incompetence. - Napoleon Bonaparte
The wisdom of man never yet contrived a system of taxation that would operate with perfect equality. - Andrew Jackson
Patriotism is supporting your country all the time, and your government when it deserves it. - Mark Twain
Back to top
View user's profile
Vince
Super Member
Super Member


Joined: May 25, 2005
Posts: 14442
Location: Brisbane AUSTRALIA

PostPosted: Wed Aug 29, 2012 9:28 pm    Post subject: Re: Loading 100 gr plinkers for 30-30 Reply with quote

If you shoot heaps of target .357 Mag loads, then by all means give casting a go...it will save you money. I used to cast two different boolits for my .357 Mag, a 124gn Conical 9mm (sized to .357) and a 150gn SWC. Neither used a gas check, but they were only target loads...and both very accurate. The alloy I used is an Aussie version of the Lyman #2 alloy...hard enough to not lead and soft enough do the job.

Now...casting for rifle is a very different kettle of fish. You need a good hard alloy and they will need to be gas checked. I found that the accuracy from my cast boolits in my Model 94 30.30 are not as good as jacketed bullets. I cast 150gn .308 Flat Nosed GC boolits from an RCBS mould. They were very accurate in my Thompson Center Contender in 30.30 but for some reason the Model 94 doesn't seem to like them as much.

Cheers, Vince

_________________
Cheers, Vince Cheers

Illegitimi non carborundum
(Never let the bastards grind you down)

Live simply. Love generously. Care deeply. Speak kindly. Leave the rest to God.

"Nulla Si Fa Senza Volonta."
(Without Commitment, Nothing Gets Done)
Back to top
View user's profile AIM Address MSN Messenger Yahoo Messenger Photo Gallery
gelandangan
Super Member
Super Member


Joined: May 07, 2006
Posts: 6080
Location: Sydney Australia

PostPosted: Wed Aug 29, 2012 10:23 pm    Post subject: Re: Loading 100 gr plinkers for 30-30 Reply with quote

Vince wrote:
HEY GELAN...ALOYS AND tlo7mm NEED YOUR ASSISTANCE WITH A SUBSONIC BLOOMPH ROUND MATE.

Seriously though guys...Gelan has put a massive amount of development/testing into some subsonic loads for his .300 Whisper and (I think) a 45.70...he is the subsonic guru.

Cheers, Vince

You rang?

_________________
A straight line is the shortest distance between two points.
A smile is the shortest distance between two people.

The government I trust .. is my .45-70 Government.

Do - Not try!


gelandangan.weebly.com/
Back to top
View user's profile Visit poster's website
gelandangan
Super Member
Super Member


Joined: May 07, 2006
Posts: 6080
Location: Sydney Australia

PostPosted: Wed Aug 29, 2012 10:48 pm    Post subject: Re: Loading 100 gr plinkers for 30-30 Reply with quote

Ok, subsonics for 30-30?

Trailboss would be great to use IF your rifle is in good condition and able to withstand the spike pressure of the very quick powder burning.
Not having know more of the background for this load, I cannot elaborate on the loads.

For a good subsonics load, it is recommended to use nitro based FLAKE type powder rather than ball or stick type.
The idea is to ensure all the powder burn within the strongest part of the barrel and thus letting the projectile to coast through the rest of the barrel and to the target.


Subsonic loads for hunting is totally different than subsonic loads for target shooting.

In target shooting, well, you just got to be accurate.

In hunting, you want to ensure QUICK kill and thus would try to either shooting as accurate as possible to the vital area (usually heart and brain), or create as large a wound as possible to the lesser vital areas (lung, nerve joints in the neck etc), or create a massive wound that would bleed profusely and thus ensure quick death, and the last one can be achieved by either tumbling the projectile or with massive weight, break the back bone of the animal.

So to ensure your projectile is able to deliver the required energy to achieve your goal, you would then wish to deliver as high energy as possible downrange.
Minding the fact that energy calculation is E = ½mv² when you have low V(velocity) you want to increase M (mass or weight) to increase E (energy).

Thus in subsonics hunting you would usually use the heaviest boolits available.
On my 300 whisper and 308W, I use a .309 cal 250 grain cast boolit that is 34mm (1.34 inch) long.
The weight of the boolit is definitely much higher than the normal for the caliber.
And in addition to that, the length to diameter of the boolit would ensure tumbling at the slightest interference.

On my 4570, I use 500 grain boolits with huge gaping hollow point, here the projectile looks squat and stocky compared to the above example, and thus it would not tumble.
On the other hand, the large hollow point will definitely expand due to the huge size.


I do not have 30-30, but I could help to calculate THEORETICALLY on the energy and velocity given a particular boolit weight, length, powder load and length of barrel.

_________________
A straight line is the shortest distance between two points.
A smile is the shortest distance between two people.

The government I trust .. is my .45-70 Government.

Do - Not try!


gelandangan.weebly.com/


Last edited by gelandangan on Thu Aug 30, 2012 1:28 am; edited 1 time in total
Back to top
View user's profile Visit poster's website
Aloysius
Super Member
Super Member


Joined: Nov 03, 2009
Posts: 2252
Location: B., Belgium

PostPosted: Thu Aug 30, 2012 12:23 am    Post subject: Re: Loading 100 gr plinkers for 30-30 Reply with quote

Geland, just to show I read it carefully: I think in our part of the world Einstein recommended to divide by 2, so E=mv²/2 Smile

And the part I don't understand is about this tumbling. What about the length to diameter ratio? When I think about tumbling I think about twist and speed...
And where they make it more difficult to me is when they recommend a fast twist for the longer and lighter monolythic bullet which wuld translate itself as an improved straight line inside the body of an animal.

And for your Whisper: I didn't know there were 250 grs bullets in .309, but when have have such a mould, ever tried to cast "lead-free" in tin? (or better 92 % tin or so for better casting)

And sorry: we have an idiom that says: "1 fool can ask more than 10 wise men could answer." I already know the fool, are you better then 10 wise men? Smile
Back to top
View user's profile
Vince
Super Member
Super Member


Joined: May 25, 2005
Posts: 14442
Location: Brisbane AUSTRALIA

PostPosted: Thu Aug 30, 2012 12:54 am    Post subject: Re: Loading 100 gr plinkers for 30-30 Reply with quote

Aloys wrote:
...And sorry: we have an idiom that says: "1 fool can ask more than 10 wise men could answer." I already know the fool, are you better then 10 wise men?

I have a saying along those lines as well Aloys...

"The only stupid question is the one you don't ask...better to ask a silly question than make a stupid mistake".

When Gelan mentions tumbling, it means when the nose of the bullet comes into contact with something, which causes the nose of the bullet to slow down, causing the tail of the bullet, still travelling at the faster speed, to start to overtake the nose of the bullet, causing the bullet to turn end over end, or tumble like a gymnast.

Albert Einstein, voted to man most likely to amount to nothing at school, his equation, as I remember it, is E=mv² or Energy=Mass x Velocity squared...but I could always, of course, be wrong.

Cheers, Vince

_________________
Cheers, Vince Cheers

Illegitimi non carborundum
(Never let the bastards grind you down)

Live simply. Love generously. Care deeply. Speak kindly. Leave the rest to God.

"Nulla Si Fa Senza Volonta."
(Without Commitment, Nothing Gets Done)
Back to top
View user's profile AIM Address MSN Messenger Yahoo Messenger Photo Gallery
gelandangan
Super Member
Super Member


Joined: May 07, 2006
Posts: 6080
Location: Sydney Australia

PostPosted: Thu Aug 30, 2012 1:41 am    Post subject: Re: Loading 100 gr plinkers for 30-30 Reply with quote

Hi Aloys,

Yes you are right..
I am not trying to short change Einstein. Very Happy
I was typing E = ½mv²
but somehow the ½ didn't show up?? Confused
Ok its fixed now. Thanks!

I have a custom mold made by NOE that casts 250gn. (247gn with gas check tail) its quite a good mold.
Noe has just finished their second run on this mold, it is one of their most popular mold.

I cast an equivalent to Lyman #2 alloy, it has about 5% tin.
tin can be really expensive and additional tin over 5% do not really help much on the flow of the alloy.

_________________
A straight line is the shortest distance between two points.
A smile is the shortest distance between two people.

The government I trust .. is my .45-70 Government.

Do - Not try!


gelandangan.weebly.com/
Back to top
View user's profile Visit poster's website
Aloysius
Super Member
Super Member


Joined: Nov 03, 2009
Posts: 2252
Location: B., Belgium

PostPosted: Thu Aug 30, 2012 3:40 am    Post subject: Re: Loading 100 gr plinkers for 30-30 Reply with quote

Well, after Vince's reaction I looked it up and now I'm confused. Einstein did say E=mc² as total energy and in my head someone is ringing E=mv²/2 as kinetic energy.
Let's only remember that speed has more influence on kinetic energy than the weight (or mass).

And for tin: you should not compare with the price of lead, but compare the price of a tin bullet with such a monolythic brass one. And some day (already started in Germany!) some stupid guy will try to stop the use of lead in bullets as they already did with shot in several countries. And that's the day you should have a few rounds with tin bullets in your pockets to show when you get somekind of control... Smile
Back to top
View user's profile
Display posts from previous:   
Post new topic   Reply to topic   Printer Friendly Page    Forum Index » Reloading Ammunition
Page 2 of 4
All times are GMT - 7 Hours
Go to page Previous  1, 2, 3, 4  Next



Jump to:  


You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot vote in polls in this forum
You cannot attach files in this forum
You can download files in this forum



Valid CSS! Valid HTML 4.01!
Click to check if this page is realy HTML 4.01 compliant for speed :)

All logos and trademarks in this site are property of HuntingNut.com.
The comments are property of their posters, all the rest © 2011 by HuntingNut.com
Interactive software released under GNU GPL, Code Credits, Privacy Policy

.: Upgraded to DragonFly 9.2 by Dizfunkshunal :.