Ok, my son has started reloading to keep the cost down and the shooting up. I haven't looked but he says the new Hornady book has 7.1gr of Hodgdon Universal max for 200gr bullet in the 45 acp. My Hodgdon books says 6.2. How can they be so different?
Also, he shot a couple hundred rounds the other day in the field behind his house. He said he picked up enough unburned powder on the snow to fill a couple of cases........what?? He shoots a Kimber 1911 with 5" barrel. Is that the extra powder?

Hodgdon's online data gives a max. of 6.3gr with a 200gr cast LSWC & 6.2gr with a 200gr JHP.
I'd stay within the limits set by the powder manufacturer myself - why use more powder for little gain?

Squirrelbait...Your son have some W-231 or WSF on the shelf? And why a maximum powder charge?

My Hodgdon (2006) load data manual shows a maximum powder charge for a 200 grain JHP at 6.2 grains of Universal. If he is using lead it sure wouldn't be that much more of a powder charge...

No not at this point.
I haven't been able to look at the new Hornady book yet, but 7.1 seems like a lot of Universal. I'm relatively new to the 45acp but I had some Universal and at 5.9gr seems like an ok load. He just went to the max with the new Hornady book I sent him for Christmas. Hasn't learned the "walk before you run" thing yet.........at 32 years old...geesh.

If it's any help. My Lyman's 49th and My Sierra Vth don't even show a listing for Universal. Just my Hodgdon manual.

Showing my total ignorance of the subject help me out here. A little different question, Bushy, but why does everyone recommend 231 or WSt or HS6.......a few others, but no one talks about Universal?
Looking at the load data in the books it looks like a good overall powder burning a little slower than 231. It seems relatively clean to me and can be pushed to the same approx velocities as the other powders?

I use Win 231 or Titegroup in the 45 ACP beneath 230gr cast bullets both with great results.

squirrelbait,
There are a number of variables that could be the reason for the difference. (crimp, case volume, seating depth, primer, etc, etc)
This is why you should get the boy to understand the walk before run thing !!!


The reason so many people suggest those powders is because they've been around a while and are proven to work.
I use Titegroup with a 200gr LSWC, It's the cleanest most consistent powder I've ever used in a semi-auto handgun.


Unburnt powder ??? yup ...that's not odd !!!

Squirrelbait, I like Universal in several loads. 231, etc., are "the old standards" that always seem to work.

Ok, so tell me if I am wrong here but what I think I am hearing is that Universal is a relatively newcomer. The other powders mentioned are tried and true. If Universal has nothing really "earth shaking" to offer why change??
Again, I'm just reviewing the books to see what powders will give me the performance. Chambered221, you probably make a good point. There are a lot of variables. Not the least of which is: what does the particular pistal like----best accuracy, etc.
So can I conclude that there is nothing inherently wrong with Universal just other powders are more familar and perform very well?

squirrelbait wrote:

So can I conclude that there is nothing inherently wrong with Universal just other powders are more familar and perform very well?

I'll go along with that !!!

chambered221 wrote:

squirrelbait wrote: So can I conclude that there is nothing inherently wrong with Universal just other powders are more familar and perform very well? I'll go along with that !!!

I'll second that.

Just as a side note, Universal Clays came about primarily as a shotgun powder designed for the 20 and 28ga. as part of Hodgdons newer line of more efficient cleaner burning shotgun powders.
The Clays lineup came about in the early 90's.

As with most shotgun powders it also works well in a wide range of handgun and pistol cartridges but doesn't dominate any one the way some others do.

221, thanks for the info. Kinda like the new "lil-gun" designed for the 410 shell but is a barn burning in my hornet.

Looks like you got your question answered.

My "go to" powder for 9mmX19, .38 Special and .45 ACP {in one of my .357 magnums) is WW-231. I use WSF in my personal carry Kimber.

I just plain like WW-231. It too, however, will leave unburned powder if you load it too light.

All in the "experimenting"...